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spud100 Profile
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Re: Trump tweets blatant xenophobic and racist comments against 3 congresspeople.


That's Crazy Thighs to you, Mister.
7/16/2019, 5:30 pm Link to this post PM spud100 Blog
 
Extropia DaSilva Profile
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Re: Trump tweets blatant xenophobic and racist comments against 3 congresspeople.


Oh, is this with regards to that incident that is making headline news here in the UK? If you believe what our news is telling us, the President told three women to go home to their countries of origin. As they are ‘of colour’ this is being represented as a racist comment.

But the thing is, there is a bit of a dismilarity between what Trump actually tweeted and what some claim he said. It really was not just a simple ‘coloureds go home!’. What he actually tweeted was [these women] “originally came from countries whose governments are a complete and total catastrophe. Why don’t they go back and help fix the totally broken and crime infested places from which they came. Then come back and show us how it is done. These places need your help badly, you can’t leave fast enough”.

To me, this reads less like a simple racist ‘coloureds go home’ and more like a bald statement of truth. There is a reason why the flow of migration is out of certain countries and into certain others, rather than the other way around, and it is that the countries from which refugees and economic migrants come are indeed often ‘totally broken’, ‘crime infested’ and run by governments for which the label ‘total catastrophe’ is wholly appropriate.

It seems to me like a great many American citizens don’t identify as being purely American. They call themselves ‘African-American’, ‘Italian-American’, ‘Mexican-American’ and so forth. I bet people like Ihan Omar and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez can be counted among people who self-identify as being partly American, and partly some other nationality. If such people are whinging about how bad things are in the US, but things are worse in the other country they see themselves as being part of, then the US President is justified in saying ‘go and help those failed nations and then come back and lecture us on what should be done’.

Another thing I have noticed is that every congressman and woman lining up to label this tweet as ‘racist’ are all Democrats. That’s like the Party of Opposition, right? I think it’s fairly safe to say that when accusations are coming from one side of the political divide there is a political agenda behind those accusations. The Party of Opposition is not above making mountains out of molehills, throwing mud around in the hope that it will stick and making grossly exaggerated remarks, all with the intention of stirring up public anger and kicking the incumbents out of office at the first opportunity.

No doubt those who describe themselves as Progressives will take Trump’s tweet out of context, concentrate on “go back” and ignore others like “come back” and see this twitter tirade as more proof of the Presidents xenophobia. But I believe his supporters will view the tweet as the plain truth. They will agree that “if you hate our country, if you are not happy here, you can leave”. That’s not racist. It’s just a statement of fact.
7/17/2019, 1:11 am Link to this post PM Extropia DaSilva Blog
 
greendocnowciv Profile
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Re: Trump tweets blatant xenophobic and racist comments against 3 congresspeople.


Extie,

Another well-put post! At the end, you note:

"That’s not racist. It’s just a statement of fact."

To deny an accusation of racism, using fact to refute it, is a dream state in many ways at this time. That problem is one part of the deep cleavage in US politics at this time.

Your nation appears to have been going through a similar race-issue. Consider our "public discussions. GB seems to have gone through in a briefer few decades of suddenly widespread "White on Pakistani's and Blacks" racial-consciounes discussion.

This can be seen as a version of the simpler "White on Black" deep-racism-public discussion that the US went over a longer period - to arbitrarily narrow it, the US traveled on such a race discussion from the 1960's to today.

During that time, we went from mildly discussing racial equality, urging it, and calling for "not seeing race"...to weirdly calling for a new "color bar" where a certain number of jobs and school seats were restricted racially, just as in "the bad old days."

With one switch. Now having a sign over some jobs and school seats reading "No Whites." And next to it, over those same jobs and school seats, one reading "Non Whites Only."

The bad connotations of this were mostly hidden. They weren't publicly discussing that clearly, factually honest way, at first, in most of the US public conversation.

This new color-bar issue was given the broad, mildly nice term of "affirmative action."

Now, here in the 21st Century, "anti-White-ness" is quite open. A few different Humanities Departments in many US Universities push "White Studies."

This school of study has grown like Topsy over the last decade or so. It trumpets very openly the idea that all Whites carry racism within them - and more-so if they don't think they do! - and go on in that direction in great detail.

As this very open "anti-Whiteness" has evolved over here for a few years now, I've noted that GB has a version of it.

I've seen clips on YouTube, of this or that activist on various Brit shows, where the accusation is tossed out that GB has a "White Racist" history. That GB needs to somehow work to repair this by apologizing to non-Whites in general establishing a non-White color bar over there. Usually parsed as something like a "fair quota for representation."

To drop a bit of reality in the racist mix of modern "Lefty" conversation, a Lefty objection evolved a few decades ago to the very well established population-sized comparison of races regarding IQ levels. Wherein, for instance, Whites fall below East Asians.

To combat that "non equality, racist" fact, an old idea in Sociological literature and other writing was revived, claiming "nonsense! Race is not real. There are no races!"

I'd like to see the modern, lefty "lets have a new kind of racism" activists square an equation combining that call with the "race does not exist" idea.



7/17/2019, 6:36 am Link to this post PM greendocnowciv Blog
 
Extropia DaSilva Profile
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Re: Trump tweets blatant xenophobic and racist comments against 3 congresspeople.


What I don’t like is the way alleged racist comments turn out to be not quite as racist as critics are accusing when you examine what was actually said.

I will give you an example from GB. When our (soon to be former) Prime Minister was the Foreign Secretary, Theresa May was said to have sent vans with the message ‘Immigrants are not welcome here’ around areas of the UK with a multicultural mix of people. But, actually, no such vans were ever sent to these areas. What there actually was, were vans with the message ‘Illegal Immigrants Are Not Welcome Here’.

To interpret a message like that as an attack on all foreign people is as silly as reading a sign in a store that says “we prosecute all shoplifters’ and imagining the store is out to persecute anyone and everyone who sets foot in it, whatever their intentions. Not at all. They just don’t want thieves coming into the store. Legitimate shoppers are not being warned against entering the store. Similarly, a message saying ILLEGAL immigrants are not welcome is not a message telling all foreigners to get lost. It’s merely a reminder that those who have no legitimate reason to be here and have not gone through proper procedure have no right to remain in our country.

Another example from the US would be that claim that Trump described all Mexicans as rapists. He never really said that. He said that because the Mexican border was not suitably patrolled and robust, rapists and drug dealers were able to get into the US. But he also included the caveat that “some, I assume, are good people”. This seems like a reasonable statement to me. If you have tens of thousands of people pouring unchecked from a country known to have drug cartels it stands to reason that while you can assume some are good folk who just want a better chance in life, others are criminals who do their adopted country no good whatsoever. In fact, I think it would be racist to assume all Mexicans are angels with none of the capacity for criminality that human beings have. That’s positive discrimination.

Time and time again it is repeated that Trump called all Mexicans ‘rapists’ but somehow his statement ‘some, I presume, are good people’ is never referenced. But if you read the full quote it’s not xenophobic, because it must be true that uncontrolled migration from crime-ridden countries lets in bad guys as well as decent folk.

7/17/2019, 8:18 am Link to this post PM Extropia DaSilva Blog
 
richiemobile Profile
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Re: Trump tweets blatant xenophobic and racist comments against 3 congresspeople.


Trump’s tweets and statements are kind of like coming from the ‘unconscious’ of the US polity. He says many things that people think but for courtesy and consideration most folks hold their tongue. This is both part of his popularity and his revulsion.

Time will tell the end result
7/17/2019, 8:56 am Link to this post PM richiemobile Blog
 
luciddream00 Profile
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Re: Trump tweets blatant xenophobic and racist comments against 3 congresspeople.


quote:

It seems to me like a great many American citizens don’t identify as being purely American. They call themselves ‘African-American’, ‘Italian-American’, ‘Mexican-American’ and so forth. I bet people like Ihan Omar and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez can be counted among people who self-identify as being partly American, and partly some other nationality. If such people are whinging about how bad things are in the US, but things are worse in the other country they see themselves as being part of, then the US President is justified in saying ‘go and help those failed nations and then come back and lecture us on what should be done’.



This is a hell of a stretch. The <something> Americans you describe don't necessarily have any loyalty to the <something> in question, they use that as an identifier about their racial makeup and a way to recognize their heritage. If I describe myself as "Caucasian" I'm certainly not suggesting I have any allegiance to Caucasus. To tell someone like AOC to "go back" to their country of origin and work on fixing it there is to tell her to stay in America and work on fixing it - which is exactly what she's doing.

Last edited by luciddream00, 7/17/2019, 9:25 am
7/17/2019, 9:21 am Link to this post PM luciddream00 Blog
 
RedQ Profile
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Re: Trump tweets blatant xenophobic and racist comments against 3 congresspeople.


Extropia, you have kick over a rock and found a bunch of squirming creatures.

The left in America is totally based on identity politics. The U.S. is suffering from the sin of multiculturalism. That's why the left always chants something like "racist, sexist, homophobic Nazi". That's why you see selective, out of context quotes like those you cited. It's what we on the Right (and Trump) call Fake News.

This has spurred the @Walkaway movement. It was started by a gay hairdresser from New York. They get Red Pilled by doing what you did: comparing what their news feed is telling them to actual facts. It's pretty cool with lots of videos. Here's the website and the introductory video. WalkAway


The left says WalkAway is a miniscule movement. I don't think so. Hey, maybe you could start a walkaway movement in the U.K. (you've already got one in Brexit).

7/17/2019, 10:04 am Link to this post PM RedQ Blog
 
James Jaeger Profile
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Re: Trump tweets blatant xenophobic and racist comments against 3 congresspeople.


Extropia wrote:
It seems to me like a great many American citizens don’t identify as being purely American. They call themselves ‘African-American’, ‘Italian-American’, ‘Mexican-American’ and so forth.

Jaeger wrote:
This is a good point Extropia. The reason this is happening is because the public school system isn't teaching the "melting pot" theory of assimilation enough. When I was in schools -- both public and private -- we always learned about the melting pot. The idea being that America welcomes people from all over the world and we welcome them to come here and live under the precepts of our Constitution.


Last edited by James Jaeger, 7/17/2019, 11:59 am
7/17/2019, 11:09 am Link to this post PM James Jaeger Blog
 
richiemobile Profile
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Re: Trump tweets blatant xenophobic and racist comments against 3 congresspeople.


Redq. The walk away website and movement you mention has little traction as far as I have ever seen,
Except here in this tiny little forum

Proud boys in their conflict with antifa seems to get all the exposure. And they supposedly disbanded.

Oh well
7/17/2019, 1:21 pm Link to this post PM richiemobile Blog
 
spud100 Profile
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Re: Trump tweets blatant xenophobic and racist comments against 3 congresspeople.


Image

¿Tienes mis cosas gratis, como prometieron los socialistas democráticos, hace 1000 kilómetros?
Chingada!!
7/17/2019, 1:37 pm Link to this post PM spud100 Blog
 


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